Just been down to the St.Pauls camp and was impressed. Lot of energy and vibrancy about and a pro-active mindset of not just waiting for something to happen but taking the initiative. Hence the second camp at Finsbury Square and the UkUncut moving off to see Dave Hartnett. There are the conspiracy types around but the world of possibilities opened up by the camp far outweighs the negatives. If November 9th action links cabbies with campers that’ll be historic! As at eton a reaction provoke a reaction – which doing nothing can never do. I echo the positive remarks about the camp of incubus,Kelly and others on here. I shall try not to be so grumpy in future.
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Ian Bone 
Nice one Ian, I was a bit harsh too, initially…Any news on the new camp at Finsbury SQUARE (not park!) ? It looks fucking massive! I’d love to see some ‘Grime’ crew or rappers down there, pulling in local kids off the estates with some choons and chats…The planned direct action from the Square may take an entirely new direction. Next up OccupydaBlock?
‘Grime’ crew or rappers? Choons and chats? Oh dear, could you be any more patronising if you tried? Apart from the fact that all ‘kids’ do not listen to the same type of music, grime is a teensy bit old hat anyway. If ‘kids’ want to get involved then they will, regardless of whether you provide them with whatever music you presume they like. They will only laugh at you.
http://kidsofgrime.com/tag/la/
Grime might be ‘a teensy old hat’ but I saw a lot of people watching someone sing ‘Amazing Grace’ this evening. That’s bloody old hat, not some musical genre that’s just a few years old.
And what? You found a website with the word grime in it? Well done, it’s probably run by older people like you who think they know what young people like.
On second thoughts…..
Ok you win. Every young person in the country is into grime. Every young person is a wannabe gangsta. No young people listen to music which features actual real instruments. All young people wear hoodies, all young people say words like ‘brap’, all young people make gun signs with their fingers etc etc.
Funny how David Cameron and co have exactly the same patronising (and wrong) viewpoint about young people as you do.
You me and the rest of us. We’ve watch protests/demonstrations come and go in the past and it always ended up pissing in the wind.One big disappointment. Who knows how this one will end ?. I think its Ladbrokes are offering 100 to1 they will still be there at Christmas. Might be worth a flutter.
You grumpy!!!!!! never hahahahahaha
Fair play, you at least admit your were wrong.
Don’t forget also the hundreds from Occupy LSX that joined the electricians to help blockade Balfour Beaty, then returned to speak at a mass assembly.
If I can, I would propose that anarchists organise a marquee down there as a lot of different groups are doing just that ( i.e University Students, Local anti-cuts groups…etc )
If it’s not going to be communism (or capitalism) what is this future society? There is no other. Maybe the speaker is referring to…communism. Otherwise it’s going to be yet another form of capitalism.
Maybe people on the street level could give an insight into the type of society people are talking about?
I might be able to get to one of these things in a week or so, if they’re still going.
I would call it Direct Democracy. Would certainly be chaotic, but I can see that technology is making communication faster.
The change will have to be people getting engaged with politics and not be so apathetic sheep.
“Direct Democracy” in a sense of wide and deeper say/control in economic and social affairs but without overcoming wage-labour?
When people say “It is not capitalism and it is not communism; it is something new” the meaning is “It is not capitalism and it is not state capitalism; it is libetarian communism”. You’re being pedantic comrade and I salute you for it!
OccupyLondon’s extension squat is now well established right in front of the Bloomberg HQ in Finsbury Square. School of Oriental & African Studies union have moved their big Mongolian yurt, a splendid affair robed in very thick white felt, from the London University to the shadow of Deutsche Bank. Finsbury Gardens, which in the bonus season plays host to hordes of fat cats & vomiting commodity traders, are ideally placed to catch the autumn sun most of the day; and the attention of the passing traffic, which is forced to stop at a set of conveniently placed City Road traffic lights. Bus drivers hooting support as they drive by. Well-wishers of all sorts dropping off donations of food, tents etc. Every time it happens big cheer goes up.
Team of volunteers yesterday (Sunday) went 60 miles to collect a set of donated portaloos. Yesterday morning requests for interviews at Finsbury Sq alone come in at 2 or 3 an hour, from likes of LBC phone-ins, Press TV (Iran), BBC Online etc. A very clued-up young Palestinian, who’s doing a course at Exeter, had done 4 or 5 no-nonsense question & answer sessions by lunch time.
Young women seem to play a major role—unusually for most such political situations—at Finsbury. Very focused & efficient, they facilitate the two general assemblies each day, for example, more so than the men. And run around recruiting campers to deal with the meeja.
One Met Superintendent, stood watching from a distance the start of yesterday’s morning meeting. He was a tad audibly contemptuous, I noticed, of two legal observers some yards away across the lawn ‘Which are they?’ I asked, not having hitherto spotted that there were any legal observers.
‘The one’s in the yellow tabards . . . Autonomous collective?’ he said. ’Now there’s a contradiction n terms. Like socialist worker’
I pointed pointed out that the meeting of hand-flutterers wasn’t in fact called an autonomous collective but a general assembly. Seeking to establish some common ground, I reminded his colleague, a Scot, that the Church of Scotland has a General Assembly. Which prompted his superior—somewhat to my astonishment—to start quoting Winstanley at me. ‘”The earth a common treasury for all . . .” General assembly was a term used by the New Model Army . . .’
He was familiar, it turned out, both with the Pelican edition of Winstanley & its suitably titled, in the Finsbury circumstances, companion volume by Christopher Hill: ‘The World Turned Upside Down.’
‘ . . . Very interesting man, Winstanley.’
Stroll on. And mind how you go.
———
PS:
Website for Finsbury Sq seems to be just cranking up:
http://occupyupdate.hubpages.com/hub/OccupyLondon
Don’t understand this acceptance let alone kowtowing to bourgeois media (sorry for oldy speak). There is enough bloody independent media these days who won’t put as much slander, lies and comedy half truths on what you say and what they see. And that’s if you must use any media at all. ‘Media’ or in this case getting ‘your message out’ / propaganda could surely be done by the people involved independently of all mediators? Or am I being too optimistic?
It’s a good point, and one worthy of raising at the Assemblies, while being ‘media-savvy’ in the sense of comms technology and academic theories about ‘representation’, many ‘activists’ are naive in terms of being part of a social movement and just how skewed, lying and disinformed the subsequent coverage will be…What worries me are the likes of faux-radical, celeb-journo-activists like Laurie Penny,(Guardian, NS,C4 News)- OXFORD educated, professional victim-survivor of sexist bulimia, and burlesque performer-Yup. (Ooh, I can see the book deal already..). People like her, carving out a career for themselves while claiming to speak for, and at the same time mould, the movements they attach themselves to, should be totally shunned like the tapeworms they are…(Think Moore, Klein, Monbiot or Porritt-ugh!)
Yep, that ‘Penny Red’ winds me up and I don’t even read her. I hear she has a new book out. New era of protests or some such bollocks. Does my head in. Maybe someone could do a sketch about Guardian journos and the like writing books after their forays into the class war – might be stretching things but you know what I mean – sharing platforms with Tony Benn after a march isn’t exactly class warfare.
Fair play to this ‘turbulent priest’
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/discord-at-st-pauls-over-protest-camp-2375100.html
http://www.lefteyeonbooks.com/2011/10/social-democratic-anarchists-and-communist-anarchists-and-the-occupy-movement/
Interesting analysis of the evolving composition of the Occupy camps
My initial impression of the Occupation Movement in London is of a diverse army of people who are transforming into a theatrical prop for a lobby of white, sharp elbowed bourgeoisies with a penchant for Labour luvvies who’ve emerged as self appointed organisers of it. There…I’ve said it. Sorry but I have to speak as I find. But I do genuinely hope I’m proved wrong and this movement does, in fact, prove to be as egalitarian as it claims to be. Who knows? It’s still early days.
Couldn’t agree more Jane, although I haven’t yet been to St.Pauls to see what’s going on.
In Norwich a sorrier bunch of fraggles I’ve yet to experience…and I’ve experienced plenty!
Yeah. I’ll join the naysayers thread. Maybe it’s a London and the regions divide?
Bristol is like a voluntary sector camping holiday. My favourite quote from an occupier yesterday explaining its merits was “it’s hard to see how anyone could find this threatening.”
Am I missing something?
Jane, I think the key thing about Occupy is that the movement is and will become whatever it is made by its participants. If you want to shape how it evolves, go down, talk to people, get involved, convince them you’re right.
{says he, from the comfort of his sofa 250 miles away]
Yeah, but yadda, yadda, I was putting the boot into the Occupations too, for not being militant enough etc, but…then I realised, I was, in my own way beginning to sound like Fox news’ version of events of OWS, and that getting on some ideological high horse and looking down our noses at these people would be shooting ourselves in the foot (*cough*)…It is early days- this time last week no-one could’ve predicted a second camp in London, and a few weeks ago nobody expected ‘occupythehood’ in the States or serving US military people offering to support OWS…We’re all at risk of becoming as sectarian as the trots we despise, by writing off movements that don’t fit our ideological model, or our preferred class composition. Sure, alot of it is bollocks, but don’t forget that these people are also putting many anarchist ideas into action, if you want it to be more radical- Make it so. Bitching from the sidelines? Perhaps that’s best left to the media…?
Yes I was down there this afternoon and sure there are lots of confused peaceniks, homeless people and followers of the divine lentil burger but there is a buzz about the place. The general assembly was interesting and there were any number of smaller debates going on that it was good to be a part of. Also two Russian tourists demanding of the City Of London Police ” why are you allowing this disgraceful spectacle to go on?” Cops making valiant effort to explain democracy to Russians. Honest!
“there is a buzz about the place”- that’s just it, and it is the buzz of people engaging in direct democracy- For some of us politically minded old anarchos etc, it’s all very passe/old hat, but for most people who never, ever get asked their opinion in their capacity as workers, never get the chance to actually discuss anything on an equal basis with their peers, and are always just told what to do by a boss, supervisor etc. it’s a fucking revelation (even middle class people, on leaving the bubble of Uni are confronted by the real hierarchical world), to actually be listened to, to have your opinion taken into account, rather than be ignored, put-down, subjected to humiliation by the stupid asshole on a higher pay-grade- this is a complete social rupture with the accepted way of relating to other people…’Knowing your place’.
@Proletarian- most people (sadly) think ‘Communism’ is the hopeless shit that Lenin, Stalin came up with, whether we like it or not, but do we really want to waste our time explaining that? I don’t give a fuck what it’s called in the long run, so long as it eliminates hierarchy and makes capitalism and the state history…
Last time the Russians had a bit of social turbulence didn’t they turn with tanks and shell the parliament?
Talk about pot calling the samovar black.
http://occupylsx.org/
To me the main asset of these camps is the possibilities offered by the General Assembly.
Hi Ian, I was just wondering if you were going to admit you were wrong for backing NATO in Libya? Kudos on the humility shown already with regards Occupy London, but surely the whole ‘humanitarian intervention’ is more of a priority from a moral stand point? x
Gadaffi and NATO? Quite funny to see his old mates Blair and Berlusconi turn against him…Thanks to popular revolt and peak oil…Collateral damage vs. Dead dictator and his heirs? Well, ‘There’s no such thing as a free lynch’…
Thought you might like this little pic Ian-
http://greenerblog.blogspot.com/2011/10/today-libya-tomorrow-wall-street.html
I don’t think Nato consulted this Blog to determine action. The Gaddafi regime was so horrendous in its killing that anything to alleviate it was a relief. No doubting that Nato, given the right circumstances, would do likewise though.
I find this bizarre. Firstly all ‘regimes’ are horrendous. Gaddafi may have been killing some thousands (has he by the way?)…but so have Cameron, Obama. Sarkozy, the AC Milan owner etc. Do we want the UN/NATO or the equivalent to bomb Britain, USA, France or Italy? There has been far more death and destruction now that NATO/UN have acted this is something undeniable. There were thousands upon thousands of air strikes and reports of many completely innocent people dying. Plus, the future is very uncertain. Conflict could rage on and on, an even worse form of government could arise etc. Surely communists should be encouraging and acting with the people in these countries not cheering on an outside force, and in this case our class enemy. What is it about Anarchism that leads to these in my view reactionary ‘positions’? I think it is based too much on emotion and not enough on thinking things through until the end…sorry for sounding like an over bearing father.
Wrongs .. wrongs .. wrongs .. overthrowing the world system will not be without its tragedies. Nato are part of the system that has enslaved & killed millions. Just some joy at the time that some massacres were halted.
All ten of them?…so far. Where the State has failed through religious, legal and police methods, they resort to using their fascist arm and the call of flagsucking patriotism…I expect the State wants to create a public order situation to discredit the occupation. The UAF will doubtless mobilise and hopefully bring the youth of Tower Hamlets with them- Should make for an interesting day…If this is a credible threat, the Assemblies of Pauls and Finsbury need to be informed…
Do the UAF pull the strings of the youth of tower hamlets? What is it with you and this strange fixation with ‘youth’? According to you young people can’t do anything without ‘rappers’ encouraging them or the UAF ‘bringing them along’. Why tower hamlets anyway? Why not the youth of Greenford or the youth of Archway? Weird.
Ian, great respect to you for admitting you were wrong re Assembly. We as anarchists have to engage with this movement, warts and all ( and there are a lot of ’em including Christian carbuncles
By the way, Al, it wasn’t “hundreds” who joined electricians action but a handful, ( i was there) let’s get things straight. Having said that when electricians then marched up to st Paul’s they got a warm welcome
Another anarcho-toff – http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2053126/St-Pauls-protests-Jack-Hartcup-son-property-tycoon-centre-Occupy-London.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
Are there actually ANY working class anarchists in Britain?
They can’t even be bothered to stay overnight. Too cold, so they toddle off back to mumsy and papas luxury townhouse for a decent nights kip – http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/8846402/Only-one-in-10-St-Pauls-protesters-stay-overnight.html
AND BEFORE YOU START, ULTRA MODERN, EXTRA FUNKY THERMAL TENTS THAT KEEP HEAT IN CAN STILL HAVE INFRA RED CAMERAS DETECT BODY HEAT.
Time for a rebrand methinks – OCCUPY LONDON STOCK EXCHANGE (only it’s not the stock exchange and we will only occupy until our bedtimes)
Caught bang to rights. TOTAL FRAUDS..
Lydia Prieg, an Oxford University alumna who is employed by the New Economics Foundation, has been invited by OccupyLSX to address the prols at St. Paul’s this after to explain to us all what a bank is. No gods. No masters. No leaders. .
@Bearded Victorian – you are just mindlessly repeating the propaganda of the rightwing media which tries to undermine any challenge to the status quo by denigrating those taking part/finding the ‘flaws’ (in this case the posh protesters or the fact that some of them are going to sleep elsewhere). So fucking what? I don’t care if they all go home at night (which incidentially they don’t), it’s still occupied and it’s a direct action street presence. Stop criticising and bitching unless your’e doing something a whole lot better which i bet my right arse cheek you’re not.
Bearded Victorian – you are a moronic twat. Do you think parrotting your Daily Wail and Torygraph crap here will get you any where. No working class anarchists? Yep, there are plenty of them, but what would you know you narrow minded little curtain twitcher, who always says yes sir to his boss and is afraid of life and even more afraid of dying becvause of his wasted subservient life.
Now fuck off.
http://sacsis.org.za/site/article/728.1
I know this is not an anarchist standpoint but there are some ideas here about standing up to the IMF, and also why Iceland and its demonsteations, has not been in the news.
ah, fuck it. Let’s have a knees up!
Good stuff at the St.Paul’s Assembly tonight- wide consensus for linking the occupation up with working class areas, and spreading the idea of occupation and mass assemblies across boroughs, plus increasing links with the Trade Unions, in particular, supporting the Electricians.
Bishop of London wants the protest to fuck off now.
“This demonstration has undoubtedly raised a number of very important questions.
“The St Paul’s Institute has itself focused on the issue of executive pay and I am involved in ongoing discussions with City leaders about improving shareholder influence on excessive remuneration.
“Nevertheless, the time has come for the protesters to leave, before the camp’s presence threatens to eclipse entirely the issues that it was set up to address.”
The cathedral said it was losing up to £20,000 a day and held its Sunday services in private for the first time since 1940.
As Sgt Major Williams used to say – Oh dear. What a shame. Never mind.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-15457669
Bishop of London, Richard Chartres, is a bit of an eggy whiff from between the cheeks of the establishment, with a list of various honours and orders including privy councillor to the queen.
Brimming with empathy for the humble folk – I don’t think.
Occupy Oakland tear-gassed last night: http://www.ktvu.com/video/29587714/index.html
http://www.ktvu.com/video/29587714/index.html
Sgt Thomas is turning out to be salt of the earth.
http://www.youtube.com/user/SgtShamarThomasUSMC#p/a/u/1/_xDFHJww1H4
Oh fer fucks sake. Here’s a blog post saying that the reason the woman was raped at Occupy Glasgow was down to lack of leadership and power structures… Whit??? Shite. If (as the clueless lassie that writes this blog proports) there were rumblings of concern about women’s safety or sexist attitudes BEFORE the rape occurred, WHY WASN’T THIS CHALLENGED AT A GENERAL ASSEMBLY? Were these concerned citizens sitting on their hands instead of flapping them about or whatever you’re meant to do?? Or waiting for a fucking “leader” to read their mind and speak up for them? Some folks just don’t get it, do they?
And you think YOU’RE grumpy?
Speaking as the “clueless lassie” who wrote the blogpost, its probably not being challenged because of the attitudes of some of the participants at Occupy Glasgow, who since the incident on Wed morning have indulged in some of the worst rape apologism, minimising, denial and victim blaming I have seen in a long time.